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Talk:Three Books of Occult Philosophy

Latest comment: 13 years ago by Doug in topic Start over
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Information about this edition
Edition: Moule: London, 1651.
Source: Esoteric Archives, MSU
Contributor(s): CSN, Lusanaherandraton, Doug, Inductiveload
Level of progress: Text being edited
Notes: Most of text appears to have been copied from esotericarchives (see above), however, no editorial comments were included other than inline word clarifications, which have now been removed, the remainder of the text is in the public domain, the author having died in 1535 and the translator in 1657. The images are public domain in the US and UK, at least.

High quality GIFs can be obtained for each page here.

Proofreaders: Doug, Inductiveload

Separate information about Fourth Book here

Chapter Status edit

Title Progress Notes
Book I. Natural Magic   Matched and Split; proofreading in progress
Book II. Celestial Magic   Matched and Split
Book III. Ceremonial Magic   Matched and Split

Headers and Footers from Electronic Version edit 

This electronic edition was based on the London 1651 Moule edition
found in the British Library:

  Title: Three Books of Occult Philosophy ... Translated ... by J. F. [i.e. John French.] 
  Main heading: AGRIPPA. Henricus Cornelius 
  Additional headings: F.. J. 
  Additional headings: FRENCH. John. M.D. 
  Publication details: pp. 583. R. W. for Gregory Moule: London, 1651. 4o. 
  Shelfmark: 1471.g.5. 
  Shelfmark: E.617. 
  Shelfmark: 232.l.7.(1) 

Graphics were supplied from 1533 Latin edition:
  Title:      De occulta philosophia libri tres
  Authors:    Agrippa von Nettesheim, Heinrich Cornelius, 1486?-1535.
  Published:  [S.l. : s.n., 1533]

Title: Three books of occult philosophy [microform] /
  written by Henry Cornelius Agrippa of Nettesheim ... ;
  translated out of the Latin into the English tongue by J.F.
Library: MNCAT U of M Twin Cities
Authors: Agrippa von Nettesheim, Heinrich Cornelius, 1486?-1535.
Uniform Title: De occulta philosophia. English
Published: London : Printed by R.W. for Gregory Moule ..., 1651.
Description: [28], 583, [12] p. : ill., port.
Series: Early English books, 1641-1700 ;
Subjects: Occultism. -- mn
Contributors: French, John, 1616-1657.
Notes: The translator is probably John French. Cf. DNB. 
  First edition in English. 
  Cf. Duveen, D.I. Bibliotheca alchemica et chemica. London, 1949, p. 7. 
Errata: p. [24].

Fourth book edit

Latest comment: 15 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

I've been reading about Agrippa lately, and both Charles Nauert (1965) and Marc van der Poel (1997) say the Fourth Book of Occult Philosophy was an anonymous work falsely attributed to him. Is there a standard way to deal with questionable attributions here, or should we keep it listed under Agrippa with a disclaimer? Lusanaherandraton (talk) 11:48, 31 October 2008 (UTC)Reply

I haven't the slightest idea (I haven't edit here in almost 2 years). I do know that he didn't write it, but it should be listed another way with a see also (or the equivalent) to that page when its created. Synergy 20:06, 30 November 2008 (UTC)Reply
Done and done! Lusanaherandraton (talk) 04:46, 19 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

Formatting edit

Latest comment: 15 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

虍 has brought up the point that each book was not originally divided into "parts," but only chapters, and has been reorganizing the book to stick more faithfully to the source. 虍 has suggested a number of options:

  • List chapters in multiple columns
  • Move chapter links to separate pages for each book
  • Use collapsible tables for chapter listings (apparently doesn't work on WikiSource now)

And of course, there's always:

  • Revert back to part divisions

I'd be interested to know other editors' ideas. I'm still on the fence, but some combination of the first three seems like it would be best. Lusanaherandraton (talk) 05:08, 19 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

I have deleted part one and two in book one as they had been tagged for a long and there was some discussion at WS:AN#Speedy deletion. I noticed that book 2 and 3 had their chpaters linked, so I did this for the first bits of book one as well. Your option two therefore seems sensible, especially as the work was not originally in parts. However the chapters could still be listed on Three Books of Occult Philosophy, I don't really mind. Suicidalhamster (talk) 15:28, 9 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Individual pages edit

Latest comment: 15 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I notice that the work is now being divided according to individual pages. However, introductory passages like An encomium have the little [page] link to the left, while there isn't one for Chapter 1, and I can't figure out how to proofread the text without it. Is this a general bug for everyone, or just a problem for my browser (Firefox 3 on Windows XP SP3, btw)? Lusanaherandraton (talk) 03:45, 25 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Table of letters & pentacle edit

Latest comment: 13 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

I've uploaded a new scan of the table of letters from the end of Book I. Though it's clearer, and from the first edition (so presumably more accurate), it lacks the "Pentacle" that appears at the head of the old scan. This feature was apparently added by the English translator (or his printer) and comes from the Heptameron of Peter of Abano. I can't imagine why, as Agrippa's text doesn't seem to mention any pentacle, so we may just want to leave it out. On the other hand, for good or ill, it is a part of the English version of this work, and may merit inclusion for that reason. Any thoughts? Lusanaherandraton (talk) 14:03, 24 November 2009 (UTC)Reply

  • There are other changes, like the sigil for Jupiter. I suggest we use the original images but include a footnote. Another question is should the errors listed in the errata be left alone, linked back to the errata (maybe with a footnote link), or fixed and linked back to the errata as a source. I suggest fix them with a link back to the errata as the source. We shouldn't be stuck with 1650s copy editing.--Doug (talk) 16:45, 3 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

Start over edit

Latest comment: 13 years ago7 comments1 person in discussion

This work has been essentially done over by User:Doug and User:Inductiveload. The work was missing sections, had very few source images and no OCR layer for the few that existed (29 gifs). Inductiveload has replaced the gifs with a .DjVu file with OCR layer for the entire set of 629 images, although the images are of lower quality, the complete set of original gifs is available at the MSU library link at the top of the page. I have matched and split the entire text and it is ready for editing. Inductive load has set up the Table of Contents, however, some chapters still need titles. The breakdown by "parts" that the old version on here had started was a relic from esotericarchives.com. Although the text clearly appears to have been copied from esoteric archives, the footnotes, side notes, and other editorial comments by Joseph Peterson have been omitted and the only relics of his work should be the clarifications of archaic spellings which are unlikely copyrightable but are being removed in any case. The information above about the text may or may not be correct and appears to have been copied directly from esotericarchives.com It may refer to another edition as this edition appears to be at MSU not the British Library. I am retaining the typographic rules of the 17th C. with ſ (w:Long s) via s, ligated ct via Template:Ct, œ, etc. ſ and ligated ct will only show in the page namespace.--Doug (talk) 18:17, 9 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

Clean up of Old pages edit

A number of old pages remain as this was earlier titled De Occulta Philosophia, the original Latin title. While this title is helpful for clarification, it is not useful for a redirect on this project and is certainly not the right title to use for the 1651 translation. These pages are remnants, together with their current status, this list will be updated as needed.--Doug.(talk • contribs) 14:56, 11 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

BookI

BookII

BookIII

Book IV

  • De Occulta Philosophia/Book 4 - A redirect with no significant incoming links and it shouldn't be here as it is an unrelated text, this is not a recognized name for this book/Delete
    • None of these are of any value - except the first one. All the others should be deleted. The text in the /Parts is of no use as the useful text is at the location where the match and split occurred. --Doug.(talk • contribs) 03:03, 12 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

Let's summarize:

All Subpages of De Occulta Philosophia

And

all subpages of Three books of occult philosophy

The redirects from the parent page names are probably useful.--Doug.(talk • contribs) 17:31, 13 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

Table of Contents edit

The text contains a table of contents, styled an "Index" and located in the place of one, at the end. It begins on Page 608 and running to the end. I propose to transclude the Index to the respective pages for each of the books as a convenience. I further suggest that the Main page include only a link to each of the books and a link to the index.--Doug.(talk • contribs) 15:39, 11 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

Status edit

I've updated the status table at the top of the page to reflect the actual status of this project and removed the references to "Parts". The old table stated that all parts were 50% complete and that images existed up through Book II Part 1; however, on coming here images were only found up though Book I, page 2! All images are uploaded and matched and split, but transclusions have not been placed on he appropriate chapter subpages and pages have not been profread beyond Ch. 6. A better indicator of status is in the Index:Three_Books_of_Occult_Philosophy_(De_Occulta_Philosophia)_(1651).djvu--Doug.(talk • contribs) 17:52, 13 December 2010 (UTC)Reply

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