and then Person 5 said that he heard gunshots outside the compound towards the north-western corner. He ran out of the compound on the western side towards where the gunshots were coming from. That took him about 10 to 15 seconds. He could see the applicant and Person 4 up to the northern corner. Person 5 shouted at the applicant asking him if they were alright. The applicant said yes and that they had just engaged two squirters to the north. Person 5 asked whether they were KIA and the applicant said yes. Person 5 went back to the Commanders' RV. He said he informed Person 81 that there would be two KIA on the northwest corner of the compound. The Commanders' RV meeting continued. One matter to note about this account if it is correct, is that it does illustrate that engagements of the nature described by Person 5 would to his mind have been regarded as a serious matter requiring immediate reporting up the chain of command.
847 However, I do not consider it is correct. There are a number of problems with it, including the following: (1) it is not supported by Persons 29 and 81; (2) if it is correct, it is inconsistent with earlier statements made by Person 5 and it is inconsistent with the applicant's evidence; (3) and it was not put to Person 43.
848 Person 29 said that he did not recall hearing the engagement described by the applicant, but that he did recall that during the exploitation of the tunnel a call went out over the radio that insurgents had been engaged, or EKIA was the term. He did not recall whose voice it was on the radio or whether the message indicated who had had the engagements. He said that a reference would have been made to the call sign, but he does not recall the reference.
849 Person 29 gave evidence that the Commanders' RV was in the right hand part of the main compound. He moved there from the tunnel courtyard. Person 29 said that at the Commanders' RV, those present discussed how the plan was going to that point and what needed to be done in the future. Person 29 said that one matter that was discussed and decided upon was that there needed to be an increase in security, having regard to engagements on the northeast side of W108. Those engagements were outside "the north-eastern quadrant of the compound" (correct cardinal points). Person 29 said he did not recall hearing the engagement, but, as I have said, he recalls that during the clearance or exploitation of the tunnel, a call went out over the radio. Under cross-examination, Person 29 said that the two engagements that the applicant said happened outside W108 occurred before the Commanders' RV was called and he said that he was quite sure that there were no engagements during the Commanders' RV. He did not
