Wikisource talk:WikiProject United States Executive Orders
Latest comment: 3 years ago by Koavf in topic New series of templates to standardize these pages
Needs Further Investigation
editOddities, inconsistencies, and similar unanswered questions concerning specific Executive Orders.
- Series of Sub-Divisions −
- Always coming across these 'phantom listings' of some sort of sub-division of EO 3016, so I figure it's better to start tracking them somewhere...
- It appears these are orders issued by the Alien Property Custodian himself, under delegated authority of Executive Order 3016. The text of some of them can be seen in this book. Unsure if those count as real executive orders or not. Carl Lindberg (talk) 16:50, 24 January 2010 (UTC)
- Never distributed & immediately superseded by 6657-A (27 March 1934)
- Subject: Withdrawal of Certain Described Lands in Arizona Pending Resurvey (07 April 1934)
- This order is apparently missing in the related bulk index file
- Revoked by EO 7454. Carl Lindberg (talk) 02:04, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Subject: Withdrawal of Public Lands to be Used for Conservation and Development of Natural Resources; Wyoming (07 April 1934)
- This order is apparently missing in the related bulk index file
- Revoked by EO 8017. Carl Lindberg (talk) 02:05, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Established Department of Justice seal (also missing)
- EO reprinted in DOJ Order No. 2400.3 (Aug. 6, 1998), can't locate a copy as well
- DOJ Order No. 2400.3, the Justice Property Management Regulations, § 128.1-5007(a), yeah. 1.28.1-5007 is here, but not the (a) part. Carl Lindberg (talk) 01:52, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Then wouldn't it be reprinted in the 1998 (or 1999?) annual compilation of the CFR? The 2012 e-CFR would be too current for that DOJ order to be listed/excerpted so that is not a surprise. -- George Orwell III (talk) 03:12, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- DOJ Order No. 2400.3, the Justice Property Management Regulations, § 128.1-5007(a), yeah. 1.28.1-5007 is here, but not the (a) part. Carl Lindberg (talk) 01:52, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- EO reprinted in DOJ Order No. 2400.3 (Aug. 6, 1998), can't locate a copy as well
- Printed in "Codes of Fair Competition As Approved ... (with supplemental codes, amendments, executive and administrative orders)" (NRA Codes), Volume 12, page 623, per the Cliff Lord book. Google Books has a copy but only snippet view at best. Carl Lindberg (talk) 02:16, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Hmmm... found a copy here. But that says EO 6785. The Cliff Lord book gives very similar subject matter for EOs 6785 and 6786-A. Carl Lindberg (talk) 02:26, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Cliff Lord's listing may be in error here. FDR's Public Papers & Addresses does not list 6786-A for example, but that may be due to the order's inclusion in the numbered series taking place after that FDR volume was first published. If there is a citation in the NRA codes, however, it must exist. I wonder why it wasn't assigned 6785-A instead being the dates are all June 30th 1934 anyway & the content seems like a revision of 6785 is some way. Go figure. -- George Orwell III (talk) 07:28, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- I'm thinking you may be right. Lord's book has the exact same NRA Codes page reference for 6785 (which is accurate). The monthly catalog only lists a single Interior Department order for that month, the 6785 one. I don't see a reference to 6786-A in the NRA codes itself (or anywhere else for that matter). Maybe it was an accidental duplicate in Lord's book? There was an absolute horde of EOs issued that week; maybe it was a mixup with 6756-A or something. The EO should at least be listed in the monthly catalog or the FDR papers. Feeling like it's a simple mistake in Lord's book. Would be nice to be able to cross-check with that CIS index. Carl Lindberg (talk) 08:13, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Superseded by EO 7012. Instructions to Diplomatic Officers and consular regulations. Carl Lindberg (talk) 01:45, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Subject: Seven additional places designated as unhealthful Foreign Service posts (5 June 1935)
- The full list as of 1941 is here; we could probably figure out the seven by comparing that list versus EO 5644 and EO 6942 (only added one post - Mérida, Mexico). EO 10000 modified the list. This book has a decision by the comptroller general, involving aspects of those EOs and the law, where a copy was sent to him apparently, but unfortunately was not published as part of the decision. Carl Lindberg (talk) 01:43, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- :-) The seven are: Boma, Belgian Congo; Mersin, Turkey; Mombasa, Kenya; Muscat, Oman; Sandakan, British North Borneo; Santa Rosalia, Mexico; and Zanzibar. Couple of others changed names, but those are the differences. Carl Lindberg (talk) 06:04, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- So add it as another partial text one? While nailing down the 7 posts is helpful, I'd rather verify it against a complete copy now instead of adding it only to forget following up on it like the rest. -- George Orwell III (talk) 07:33, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah, not sure it's quite enough for a partial article -- the ones we have were at least descriptions from other government sources and contain chunks of the actual language. It's better than nothing, but maybe it'd be best to wait and see if we can turn up the full EO eventually. I have found the full text of one of those partial orders before, but it's not likely at this point, short of going to the National Archives maybe. Carl Lindberg (talk) 15:43, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
- Subject: Amendment of Executive Order No. 7972 of September 15, 1938, Prescribing Currency Exchange Rates in Luxemberg (06 December 1940)
- This order is listed in the related 1936 to 1965 Index, showing not published in Vol. 5 of the Federal Register & page 842-A in the 1938-1943 Compilation
- This order is apparently missing from the NARA online listing
- The Title 3, 1938-1943 Compilation doesn't seem to have a page 842-A -- George Orwell III (talk) 02:00, 20 June 2012 (UTC)
ARCHIVED
- verification−
- Titled simply "Korea" in the NARA Disposition Tables. Signed: January 5, 1949.
- This Executive order was not received for publication in the Federal Register aparently.
- No entry or content in .sgml file at Archive.org for Executive Order 10026-A
- No entry or content for EO 10026-A at Truman Library
- just wondering if this might be found in military related archives or something similar instead.
- It apparently assigned responsibility for economic aid in Korea to the Economic Cooperation Administration. I couldn't find the text with a quick search. Carl Lindberg (talk) 14:56, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
- Bit more info; This State Department publication states: On January 5, 1949, President Truman issued confidential Executive Order No. 10026-A, effective January 1, 1949, providing for continued assistance by the United States to the maintenance of the political and economic stability of the Republic of Korea. Under the terms of the Executive Order, the Economic Cooperation Administrator was instructed to take over the relief and rehabilitation program carried on by the Department of the Army in Korea since 1945. The Secretary of State was instructed to assume responsibility for information and educational-exchange activities in Korea previously carried on by the Department of the Army. It mentions a statement on page 84 in the Department of State Bulletin of January 16, 1949, which can be seen here, with basically the same info. So the substance of at least part of the order was made public that same day (Jan 5), but not the text of the order apparently. Carl Lindberg (talk) 05:54, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
- Good researching, Carl. I hope you don't mind but I took the liberty of taking the above and creating an article for it much like Executive Order 10695-A. Hopefully, there will be later EOs that amend or revoke 10026-A as well. George Orwell III (talk) 06:32, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
- That first document also gives a reference of "895.50 Recovery/1-549" for the executive order. That didn't make any sense to me, but searching around, I think that is a reference to a document stored in the National Archives (part of Record Group 59, which is the Department of State materials). I think "895.50 Recovery" is a file unit or some other identifier, and 1-549 refers to the date. No idea if the order is still confidential or not. Carl Lindberg (talk) 04:12, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
- It should no longer be classified but can't say for sure. Also may be of INTEREST. George Orwell III (talk) 09:41, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
EOs Missing Images
edit{summary or description info here eventually)
- Executive Order 5228, November 21, 1929 MAP
- Executive Order 5752, December 3, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5757, December 16, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5758, December 16, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5759, December 16, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5760, December 16, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5761, December 16, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5765, December 24, 1931 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5800, February 17, 1932 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5801, February 17, 1932 Missing MAP
- Executive Order 5925, September 21, 1932 Missing MAP
Manual of Style
editArticle Naming
edit- TBD
Article Formatting
edit- TBD
Linking
edit- TBD
Templates
edit- Work in progress…
- {{Potus-eo}} − Executive Order header template.
- Basically does what the next two templates do as well as any typical header all-in-one with the addition of automatically figuring out which President created the Executive Order just by the EO# and creates both an external link to a government listing to verify citation info and an internal Wikisource link to the Wikilist of EO's for that President (works from FDR to Obama Administrations}. See the templates documentation for details.
- Template:USFedReg - The Federal Register via GPO Access
- Template:CodeFedReg - The Code of Federal Regulations via GPO Access
- … add as determined as needed
Categorization
edit- Use [[Category:Executive orders]] as a parent category so that other non-US executive orders can be placed under this category
- Use [[Category:United States executive orders]] as this WikiProject's top level category
- Create a category for each president, [[Category:Executive orders of George W. Bush]], so that pages like this Author:George W. Bush/Executive orders do not need to be maintained by hand.
- Cat alpha sort key into [[Category:United States executive orders]] should be "Last, First M."
- [[Category:Executive orders of 2005]], Same low-maintenance rationale to create a category for each year.
- Cat alpha sort key into [[Category:United States executive orders]] should be "2005"
- Create a category for each president, [[Category:Executive orders of George W. Bush]], so that pages like this Author:George W. Bush/Executive orders do not need to be maintained by hand.
- Use [[Category:United States executive orders]] as this WikiProject's top level category
Every plan needs to start somewhere, so here is a first pass. — MrDolomite | Talk 16:13, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Inventory
edit- United States Executive Order Count by year issued
as of Jan. 16, 2010
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as of November 10, 2010
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Executive orders
editHi, I see you created the template Potus-eo, but it only currently being used on the most recent executive orders. Executive orders issued by George Bush and before all seem to be using the Header2 template. Do you need help making the conversion for all of the previous executive orders? I will be happy to help. Only thing, there are so many executive orders, a bot would be very useful to make the switch. Thoughts? Maximillion Pegasus (talk) 01:53, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
- Hello, pleased to meet you. . . yeah, that's pretty much the way I found the Executive Order category in general months ago and have tried to take a stab at making them more accessible but it's been slow going. I don't believe there was ever any agreement on applying a style guide aross whatever already existed let alone what to follow when creating new ones. Anyway, I got fed up enough try and make a template that would do some of the work for you (see the eo-potus template's documentation). I applied it to the 2 dozen or so 2009 orders generated so far but there is still some reason why it's trigging their filters for missing header. It works fine the best that I can tell but I figured I better apply it piece-meal as I happen to edit one or two for now just in case.
- I'm no expert (but not exactly clueless either) so I'd appreciate any imput or ideas on what's the best way to move forward with the goal in mind of applying it to whatever exists in the category to date at some point in the near future. Thanks. George Orwell III (talk) 02:29, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
- I see. Well, I'm not sure, applying it manually would take some time. Well, I plan to be working on Author:George Herbert Walker Bush/Executive orders in the immediate future, and should I use the Potus-eo template on the executive orders' pages I create or use the Header2 template? Maximillion Pegasus (talk) 16:04, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
- Sorry for the delay - I'm going to try one more request to try and clear the air on the missing header message but in the interim how you approach H.W.'s missing orders really depends on what your underlying intent is. My feeling is that without credible citations, not many will be prone to utilize the information found there. If you're just out to complete the list for the sake of completeness that's fine too. In short, if you can put up with the erroneous error message everytime you create/edit an EO then I'd use the Potus-eo template. If you are not then, I can at least thank you for time and effort in rounding out a woefully lacking section of the EO category. George Orwell III (talk) 22:36, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
UPDATE: I finally figured out what I left out of the Potus-eo header that kept causing that erroneous missing header message when editing/creating EO's under it. The auto-populate stuff for the citation bar info should work fine now with all EO's all the way back to somepoint midway through FDR's administration. Drop me a note if anybody finds something wrong when applying it. Thanks. George Orwell III (talk) 04:09, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
Sub-Page Formatting
editNot quite done but figured I better back it up somewhere
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This is a work by an Executive Officer or designee thereof within the Executive Office of the President of the United States, created during the course of the person's official duties. As a work of the U.S. federal government, the work is in the public domain (see 17 U.S.C. 105). |
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Added to {{active projects}}
editThis lame duck had never noticed that there was a specific project page for EO stuff, anyway, now paid attention and added this project to the Template:Active projects. {{Active projects}} rotates through the projects and should display this project on {{welcome}} one week in five, and is active currently. At the page there is instructions about just having the banner for use for your project.
Note: for your image, I have temporarily inserted File:Emancipation proclamation typeset signed.jpg though it is hardly stimulating, so you can either update it yourself, or identify an image that you would like, and I will add it in. — billinghurst sDrewth 10:01, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
New series of templates to standardize these pages
editI've created:
to make standardized layouts of executive order pages. I am also trying to fix some very poor semantics where tables were nested within tables (!) and some arbitrary and needlessly confusing stylizing. See this in action at Author:William Jefferson Clinton/Executive orders, where only 1993 has been converted but 1994 to 2001 remain as they were. Any thoughts? —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 09:38, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Koavf: These look good; these are better than the manual copy-pasting of the template from prior administrations and these can be easily modified as well to customize the layout and add onto these as well. Great job :) - Kamran Mackey (talk to me · my contributions) 16:52, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Koavf: Very glad you took some time to get these templates together. I am happy to use templates over whatever mish-mash of formatting is there currently. The only suggestion I have is that there should be more padding between the columns (and maybe the rows too slightly). Other that, the example looks great to me. Clay (talk) 22:20, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Clay: For what it's worth, it won't hurt my feelings if you tinker. I agree that they're a little bunched. Go wild. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:15, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
- I haven't worked on templates before, but I will try to look at this later today and see what I can do. Clay (talk) 16:19, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Koavf: I did some tinkering a couple days ago, and it looks like we will either have to modify the {{Eolist2-item}} to include padding (as padding seems to be applied per-cell, we would have to do it at this level), or make the columns a fixed width, in order to have padding for the cells. I would prefer to add the padding to the template as I think it would be a better solution, but I know the template is used a lot already outside of this one test, so I'm not sure if we should make a third(?) row template, or try to modify this one to suit our needs? Clay (talk) 17:22, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Clay: Agreed that padding should be relative, not absolute. Just try remixing it and then use the preview function. I'd prefer to not fork but you can always just port it over to {{EOrow}} and edit that and then replace it on the Bill Clinton page to see how it works in the wild. Thanks so much for collaborating with me on this. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 02:08, 31 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Koavf: I did some tinkering a couple days ago, and it looks like we will either have to modify the {{Eolist2-item}} to include padding (as padding seems to be applied per-cell, we would have to do it at this level), or make the columns a fixed width, in order to have padding for the cells. I would prefer to add the padding to the template as I think it would be a better solution, but I know the template is used a lot already outside of this one test, so I'm not sure if we should make a third(?) row template, or try to modify this one to suit our needs? Clay (talk) 17:22, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
- I haven't worked on templates before, but I will try to look at this later today and see what I can do. Clay (talk) 16:19, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Clay: For what it's worth, it won't hurt my feelings if you tinker. I agree that they're a little bunched. Go wild. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:15, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
Relevant discussion on article naming
editThe current version of this WikiProject states that the style of article naming is "Executive Order (contiguous numbering scheme - 1 to 99999)". A discussion on whether executive order's naming convention should be changed to "full title" ("actual name") is ongoing at Wikisource:Scriptorium#Title of an executive order. Editors who are interested in this issue may participate in the discussion there. --Neo-Jay (talk) 17:53, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
New batch of Federal Register scans
editIt seems like how we have been approaching these new executive orders is that we get a page set up quickly with the White House website source information, then replace later with the Federal Register scan version once the scan is proofread. This makes sense to me, so I will assume this is how we will continue doing things, but we can also discuss this if anyone doesn't agree.
On that note, there are a bunch of new executive orders that have been printed, therefore a lot of scans to be processed. I've compiled a list of scans that need to be proofread/validated, if more people want to help out:
Trump:
- Index:Executive Order 13982.pdf - validate
- Index:Executive Order 13983.pdf - validate
- Index:Executive Order 13984.pdf - validate
Biden:
- there used to be a list here
(Thanks to User:Koavf for helping out thus far.)
Cheers! Clay (talk) 19:34, 26 January 2021 (UTC) (last updated 22:36, 29 January 2021 (UTC))
- To be clear, I started doing executive order stuff four years ago and because of personal reasons, I got less motivated to continue. With the new administration, I've made it a point to do this daily (I also did a similar thing with the 116th Congress). All this to say, I don't think there's anything systematic about the process, just how I have kind of stumbled into it lately. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 22:16, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
Looks like we're pretty much caught up again. I'll stop updating this for now except to remove finished scans. Thanks again @Koavf: for doing the validation for these scans. Clay (talk) 22:36, 29 January 2021 (UTC)
Template:Federal Register and page ranges
editI fixed the Federal Register template links today (the links it was generating were fundamentally broken), and noticed that including page ranges instead of a single page number in the |page= field breaks the link as well. I looked into how to include the page range in the template and came up with some possible solutions:
1. Adding a "page_end" field (or similar name).
- Pros: Easiest way to update the template without advanced features.
- Cons: Seems a bit less clean than the other solutions.
2. Using the string parser function #explode to separate the page range in the template (see mw:Help:Extension:ParserFunctions#StringFunctions).
- Pros: Slightly easier for template user to use, no change in the template parameters, no change in the current template uses in mainspace.
- Cons: Looks like we would have to get someone to enable this feature for this wiki (unless I just failed in my initial attempts to use the function).
3. Restore the page ranges to the single start page number.
- Pros: No template work required, in line with the official citation format.
- Cons: Loses out on that little bit of data.
Thoughts on what route we should take here? Clay (talk) 17:50, 30 January 2021 (UTC)